Thursday, September 23, 2004

Forward this to EVERYONE

Another we-feel-like-killing festival a pilot reports unarmed civilians walkin gthe streets of falluja and requestas permission to "take them out" and gets it in a blink, after killing them he says: awwww dude!
enjoy libration.
forward this to everybody you know, start with the war supporters, and the forums you usually visit.
The world needs to know how things are in Iraq.
khalid*

74 Comments

#9/23/2004 01:03:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger aNarki-13

hmmm.. mindless indeed.
However, what seems strange is the fact they were moving in a group.. i mean, if the town is surrounded, and ALL OTHER STREETS are empty, how come these guys appear from nowhere and vanish into a SANDCLOUD when all the missile hit was houses and concrete?
I'm not saying its fake, I'm just saying MAKE LOVE F**K WAR AND ITS MONGERS, whomever they may be.
Hard to feel sympathetic for anyone these days. too many deaths, too much pain.
later
13out.

 
#9/23/2004 01:13:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Well, I took a look at the Fallujah video, and all I can say is that if this is how the US military determines its targets then your soldiers are prime candidates for Saddam's death squads. They have no problem whatsoever in mowing down whomever is about.

No better than Saddam.

All you can see are a bunch of dots moving in the street, there's no way to see if they're armed or not; they don't appear to be in a fighting formation (ie - in a double line abreast, or moving from cover to cover) and basically, if the pilot based his decision to bomb on that, then he is a murderer. For all he knew, he just bombed the Falluja Philharmonic Orchestra on its way to a practice session.

Any sympathy I had for US troops on the ground, those supposedly earnest ones that 'meant well', is rapidly evapourating, let me tell you.

And people wonder why the Iraqis are "ungrateful" ...

 
#9/23/2004 01:14:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger liminal

Khalid, is there any way we can verify this was in Fallujah? And is there any way we can find out beyond a shadow of a doubt that these are civilians?

Where does this video come from?

Let's figure this thing out.
lim.

 
#9/23/2004 01:45:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Lim's right. We must know more about the clip.

 
#9/23/2004 02:50:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Mister Ghost

EEEEEEEEKKKK! It's Those Evil Americans Again.

Meanwhile some of Khalid's fellow Iraqi Baathist types
have killed the two Italian hostages.

 
#9/23/2004 03:34:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

http://www.canadiancontent.net/forums/ntopic1591.html

is a link that seems relevant at the moment

 
#9/23/2004 06:03:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Mister Ghost

More Evil American News: There's a film out showing the Americans kidnapping the Man on the Moon
and threatening to deport him to Mars unless he cuts them in on a large cheese concession.

Meanwhile back in Iraq, Khalid's fellow Iraqis can buy
videos of Hostages Throats Being Slitten at the Thieves Market in Baghdad

 
#9/23/2004 06:25:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

You can't see anything in that video except a bunch of black dots. You can't tell what or who those people are let alone if they are "armed" or not. And I don't have a problem believing these people/black dots, could be part of the "resistance" walking slowly. I mean, we see these guys, the "resistance" walking slowly every night on the news with their guns, RPG's in hand, etc. The US military is not that stupid.

 
#9/23/2004 08:27:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Jeffrey

That is a very educational video. I liked it very much.

One thing you need to understand is that air-ground coordination in the Air Force started over fifty years ago in the Korean War. The American military learned that jets were much more lethal if they had trained people on the ground with the troops directing fire. So they started to put pilots on the ground with the ground troops and he would talk to the pilots in the air to direct hits.

You can be sure that there were American eyes on the ground where that collection of terrorists was making its way down the street. We had the ability to coordinate strikes FIFTY YEARS AGO. More than any other nation, we have continued to hone our skills in this area. This video is a good example of the lethality that we can bring to the insurgents and terrorists.

I've watched that video several times. Excellent.

*

 
#9/23/2004 09:50:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Jeffrey,
I'm glad you pointed that out about how strategic the US military is when they do an air strike.
Khalid and others have GOT to stop believing everything they read and/or hear about the "evil American empire."....I'm not saying there aren't mistakes in war, there certainly are, and America does make some, but to believe that the US is targeting civilians just for the fun of it or as Khalid puts it a "we feel like killing festival" is LUDICROUS and ABSURD!
Connie

 
#9/23/2004 10:57:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

They looked like terrorist to me all running down the street together, moving to the next position to attack. I doubt that these were civilians the streets were all empty, everywhere.
This is a scene from a battle, not a duck shoot.
If I where you I would tell your terrorist friend that they will never win and that they should surrender their weapons and go home.
Maybe you should learn something about ground spotters and how they identify the enemy on the ground for the planes to have their turn.
Thanks for the cool video, I want to post it elsewhere.

Madtom

 
#9/24/2004 12:07:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Wow, sick people posting that the obliteration of human beings is 'excellent' and 'cool'. And trying very hard to rationalize and justify it. Then dumb people thank the sickos for providing a fantasy context in which they claim the killings occurred. Then the trio of sickos are content because their agreed-upon invented interpretation of the incident - not based on any facts mind you, but sickos don't need facts - allows them to pretend that the obliteration of human beings is a 'righteous' act. Next time some grouping makes a pretext for slaughtering more Americans I wonder if they'll apply the same logic and agree that the 'shifty, suspicious looking civilians were probably up to something and so the terrorists were justified in taking them out'.

What a sad, sick, racist bunch of creeps.

 
#9/24/2004 12:34:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

Would you like me to post a couple beheading videos for you so we can all learn from your humanity.
It's fuck'n war zone, the friendly's should leave the battlefield. And I'm sure they would if permitted by the "resistance". But then they would lose their pawns.

Madtom

 
#9/24/2004 12:58:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

how is it that we are "racist" mr or mrs no-name "anonymous"? Please enlighten me with your wisdom....I am ever so eager to learn.

Connie

 
#9/24/2004 02:16:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

very impressive accuracy


obviously military targets, moving in formation down otherwise deserted town

taken out with the minimum of fuss , effort and expense


excellent job, USAF

 
#9/24/2004 02:16:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

very impressive accuracy


obviously military targets, moving in formation down otherwise deserted town

taken out with the minimum of fuss , effort and expense


excellent job, USAF

 
#9/24/2004 02:48:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Yeah! Go U.S. Air Force!! YaY!!!! Kick some ass!!

Connie

 
#9/24/2004 05:45:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

haiya allah ahla alfalluja elkolhom shoj3an
ma dallo ras-hom we thallo el amreekan
haiya allah ahla alfalluja elteejan irras
weldeen alla wo rasoola wigfaw horras
feehom sharet elyamma we jithl alabbas
wesh haldarba el bazoka teso elmeedan
haiya alla bahla elgheera we bahl el namoos
we esh had amreeki yegarreb lel deera yedoos
yamahla elmoot be ezza we mo belkhothlan
Yeah! Yay! Fallujans kicked americans ass with a couple of RPG's and Klashinkovs....

 
#9/24/2004 10:07:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

u have a video link to that ??

 
#9/24/2004 11:37:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger What?

I've seen the video elsewhere. What? I have not been able to do is corroborate it with anything. Because of that, I think it is safe to say that nobody can say for certain What? it is your looking at. For all I know it is just a complete fake from start to finish. I am quite sure an amatuer film maker could produce such a thing quite easily.

Frankly I think people that are willing to rush to judgement when they don't know What? they are looking at for sure are idiots.

If anyone can prove it is genuine than post some links.

 
#9/24/2004 04:42:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

The link Bruno mentioned is indeed worthfully.
And something comes to my mind: is it so that Canadians have better historical education than the US-ians?
Or do they just have less problems with their history, so they have to hide less...?
http://www.americanpolitics.com/20010727Negroponte.html

Ever heard of the documentary: Manufacturing Consent? Take a look at :
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Chomsky/LegacyWar_RSChom.html
(sorry, i am a bit like a child, i can copy+paste, but the glue gets all over the place...)

Or to read the script of the movie, you can go here:
http://www.zmag.org/chomsky/mc/index.cfm

I think it is necessary to know where these immages of 'Falluja' were filmed, and i think it is disgusting to take for granted that it is 'just' to kill etc, while you can't know what really happened, and even if you did know!
Ever heard of ideas of fair trials? Of transparancy?
I still have huge problems with accepting that the invasion of Iraq started with a bunch of lies http://www.coxar.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/
by a bunch of secret service crooks and their beloved 'politicians' or vice versa. That's one.

Then of course, the second situation: Saddam Hussein and his 'baathi-machine' out of power and the 'allied-with-few' troops in. Now EVERY effort will have to be made to create legal grounds for how society is organized, or is trying to get organized. Without legal grounds, killing here and there by the good 'side' and by the bad 'side' will result clearly in no 'good' sides at all anymore, except for the people without any power at all, who 'just' try to survive these nasty realities, and try to communicate (!) with people by blogging.
Respect please!

(I mean: you Us-ians know of course the history of John Negroponte in Central America is it? Or: who is Oliver North? C'mon! Some brain excercising!
http://www.americanpolitics.com/20010727Negroponte.html
Now does this create 'safer' feelings? And if so: for who?)

*----- hehhh, i feel much better now! -----*
cecile

 
#9/24/2004 06:32:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger khalid jarrar

hahahahaha
very funny jeff. eye epotters?
american eye spotters in falluja?
hahaha..
your army men (can i call them men?) didnt dare to touch the ground of falluja since they have been screwed badly there last time, except of cource by bobing the houses and streets of the "bad people".
an american in falluja ha? his american ass would have been hanged on the bridge long time ago.
what the hell do you know?
mojahideen are in the beginning and end of EVERY ally in falluja to make sure the security sitiation is stable (probably the only place with security in iraq) and to spot an arab or even an iraqi wo isnt from falluja makes people ask questions.
an americn in falluja?
since when do i have to deal with this bulshit?

 
#9/24/2004 07:43:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Khalid,
What makes you think the spotters are American? They could have informants working for them....like that teenage boy "Steve-O"...he turned in his own father who was a leader in the mahujadeen.
Connie

 
#9/24/2004 09:56:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Jeffrey

Thanks Connie for pointing out the obvious to Khalid.

We had many Iraqi spies in Iraq leading up to and during the war. They were given GPS devices to allow us to "lock and load" from the sky and bring death down on their heads.

The soccer fields of Falluja are filled with scum. A political decision halted the cleaning out of Falluja. I was pissed off about that, just as I was about the political bullshite in Najaf. Myself, I would have done a Sherman on Falluja. In our Civil War, General Sherman knew that to defeat the South he needed to absolutely and unambiguously CRUSH the Confederate troops and their land. He took Atlanta and then marched his troops to the ocean, his forces stretched out sometimes sixty miles wide. They killed anything that moved and burnt anything of value all the way to the ocean. That was one massive slice into the belly of the South. Then, in winter, when no one expected it, he moved directly north and continued his path of destruction. A second massive slice into the belly of the South. Their guts fell out and NOT ANOTHER WORD OF SECESSION HAS BEEN MENTIONED IN ONE HUNDRED AND FORTY YEARS! I can only hope after the election, the gloves come off and the Fallujan cesspool of scum is Shermanized down to the fine blown sand of the Sunni Triangle.

As ever, your friend Jeffrey, always merry and bright!

*

 
#9/24/2004 11:56:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Yeah Falluja just needs to be polverized. I mean enough is enough. I have no more sympathy for these people...I'm over it. The US needs to give everybody a heads up and re-locate the people that want to leave. I'm sure there is a palace or two around there that could be used to house these people. Then the ones that don't want to go...well...sorry...you had your chance...."buh-bye"....just blow it the hell up. The people who don't want to be a productive member of society have no reason to be there then....Once the "resistance" is gone we can re-build it...put a mall or two there...Starbucks...whatever....it'll look great really.
Connie

 
#9/25/2004 12:09:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

btw khalid was the guy running at the back in that video

 
#9/25/2004 04:07:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Connie = Jeffrie's second personality? Small Hitchcocky?
sorry, won't tell you my name(s) this time ;)
Or wait: McGuffin seems the right i.d. for this moment!

 
#9/25/2004 05:57:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

McGuffin,
Well if that is true and Connie really IS Jeffrey's "second personality" than he is going to be in great distress come November 2, 2004. Because when Jeffrey is in the voting booth HE and his "first personality" will want to vote for Bush, while Connie i.e. his "second personality" will be wanting to vote for Kerry.
No, no, no...Jeffrey and I probably agree on very little in regards to politics. But what we DO agree on is that we are both sick and tired of this "resistance" nonsense in Iraq and we are ready to KICK SOME ASS!!!
Connie

 
#9/25/2004 12:42:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

i thought there was an element of sardonic sympathy in the pilots voice when he says 'aw dude'

 
#9/25/2004 04:27:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

More Iraqi civilians killed by US forces than by insurgents, data shows

 
#9/26/2004 06:46:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

Khalid, hey tell all your terrorist friends, just kidding.

My name is Madtom and this is my first blog.
There are a lot of blogs out there and I want to make this one a little different. I will post what I see out there or link to news or other blogs that bring news from the front lines.
Once I figure out how, I want to put up a picture in the title of the Norman Rockwell painting "NEWS FROM THE FRONT". Like the characters in that painting we are all eager to hear news from the front.

The thing that I want to do different with this blog, is that I want to post stories from the point of view of all the different characters that make up this war. I want to post stories from G.I.Joe, and from his enemy and from the point of view of their families. The idea is for anyone, be they friend or foe that has something to say, a story to tell, about this, or any war, can send it to me and I will post it here, anonymously.

I am doing this so that the public at large can get an idea of what is going on in this war, and for those doing the fighting can have their stories told. I want to try to do it from all sides. The good the bad and the ugly.
So if you have a story that you think needs to be told, and you want a forum to tell your story then e-mail them to me at thisfckingwar@yahoo.com
Read them all at thisfuckingwar.blogspot.com

There is only a few rules, it has to be good, about a war and anonymous.

 
#9/26/2004 07:50:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Sure, a blog full of invented anonymous stories is just what the world needs right now. All you armchair warriors can inundate this loony's blog with made-up war adventures, Jeffrey the Spotter from Fallujah and his endless search for clean underwear (maybe Jeffrey the spotty, spotted Spotter from Fallujah would be a better 'handle'?), Connie the Atom bomber who misreads everything and ends up bombing Dubai by mistake (well, I saw camels, and sand - lots of sand - and guys in robes. They had to be guilty of SOMETHING damn it!), all the ex-USAF boys reliving their glory days bombing the arms and legs off women and tiny children in Iraqi cities, towns and villages – chickens too afraid to fight their own shadows penning stirring tales of derring-do. Yep, all the makings of a real lunatic asylum. Don’t expect many Iraqis though – they won’t want their IP addresses being known by a nutjob like you.

 
#9/26/2004 08:28:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

well there is no way around the need for anonymity.
I hope that there will be a few brave souls out there that want to tell a story and will get the ball rolling. Part of the fun of this blog will be that no one will know for sure if it's real of a complete fiction. something that today you don't know about most news organizations.
One thing you can be sure of is that if it's good, it's not written by me.

Madtom

 
#9/26/2004 09:15:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

What ip's from some internet cafe?
Just make up some new e-mail address on yahoo or something and hit send, That ip wont do anyone any good. But why would a warrior be afraid of something as silly as that.

Madtom

 
#9/27/2004 06:24:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Janice

This is a war crime sanctioned maybe not by actual speech or writing but by the attitude of the Bush administration.

 
#9/27/2004 06:24:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

"The US military is not that stupid."

This is the crux of the matter. And, yes your military is as stupid as that and more. There have been countless massacres and 'mistakes' perpetrated by your heroes dating back to as long as you care to go. My Lai anyone? In Iraq alone there have been a series of incidents where people that were clearly civilians have been machinegunned or what have you. I suppose you will make the case that Gaith was an 'insurgent', now ... ? The incident that set off the Fallujah resistance was the brave machine gunning of 16 unarmed protesters by marines. Remember? Remember the USAF's penchant for 'dropping in' on wedding parties?

Madtom, Connie et al : the pilot himself reported 'numerous individuals'. He DID NOT say : "Abdul at the corner cafe' has said Zarqawi is moving into position." Ergo, he did not receive any 'tell' from the ground. HE was the one who reported the target. The attack was based on the strength of his own report. Possibly they were insurgents. Possibly they were civilians. I can't really say, because all I see are a bunch of black dots, and that is what the pilot saw too. Like I said, if this is how the USAF decides on its targets, then they are a bunch of murderers.

 
#9/27/2004 06:29:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Connie --

"I'm sure there is a palace or two around there that could be used to house these people."

With no trace of irony this ... clown ... makes this statement, ignoring the fact that Saddam's palaces have been reoccupied by the new 'masters' of Iraq, the US Army and their sweaty palmed political friends ... keep it up, if nothing else, you sure are entertaining me ...


Jeffrey --

Your excitement over Sherman's march, where, in your words "They killed anything that moved and burnt anything of value all the way to the ocean.", simply makes me wonder about your mental state, not to mention your wayward moral compass. More specifically, this seems to be what you think will pacify Iraq, and are getting a boner in anticipation for all the massacres to follow.

Please, in a short paragraph, outline to me exactly how your plan to control Iraq differs from Saddam Hussein's approach. This is your big chance to show us what you have, don't waste it.

 
#9/27/2004 06:35:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Iraqi hater type folks (like J & C et al), you know, perhaps your attitude is the best of all. Here I am, sitting with a knot in my stomach at the crap that is going down, and the injustice of the world, and you are convincing yourselves that it's all OK and justified.

You even manage to feel good about it.

Maybe I should try your tactic, the next time there is a 9-11.

That is, to convince myself that all those people were baby murdering scum. I mean, they knew that the WTC was a prime target for AQ, so it makes sense that only the real hard core CIA and neocon operatives would be left there. It got hit before, so all the civilians there musta been looong gone. Now I too can guiltlessly laugh at the guy freefalling from the 100th story with his ass on fire, maybe if he flapped his arms harder he might make it to the next building ... you are correct ... I feel much better ...

But am I right?

 
#9/27/2004 07:43:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Bruno...Darling....LIGHT of my LIFE!

I don't hate Iraqis. Are you kiddin' me? No, no, no! Iraqis are some of the best lookin' men on the planet!! I ain't EVEN kiddin'! So, no. I could never hate Iraqis....or anybody for that matter.
Your analogy about the WTC I didn't understand....something got lost in translation there....

Your ever-loving FAVORITE American,
Connie

 
#9/27/2004 09:48:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Jeffrey

Brunhilda, if you can't tell the difference between the running of a government and a military operation, you're not worth engaging.

BTW, we are indeed a bunch of murderers. I would love to slice your belly open. Believe me, I would do it with a smile on my face as your intestines dropped to the ground.

As far as injustice in the world, it will never go away. That knot in your stomach you talk about -- well, I hope it is cancerous. That would serve such a jerk-off as yourself. (Hey, BTW, I see that at the jail they've decided to give you back your Internet privileges! I'm happy for you!)

As ever, your friend, Jeffrey

*

 
#9/28/2004 06:13:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Hey Bruno,
Can I ask you a question? I can? Okay....

Where are you from? What country? I was just wondering...pure curiosity...thats all.

Connie

 
#9/28/2004 07:03:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger Jeffrey

Connie,

Brunhilda is a Whitey from South Africa. He he. And he's talking all righteous about injustice in the world. Man, this guy is too much, right.

He's a joke.

*

 
#9/28/2004 07:08:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger Jeffrey

Oh yeah, here in the Evil Empire, the Bad Old US, I have one brother-in-law who is African-American and another brother-in-law who is an Igbo from Nigeria. A sister-in-law from the Philippines and my wife is Chinese.

Yes, Bruno, miscegenation, so we must REALLY BE EVIL, right?!

*

 
#9/28/2004 08:28:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger Alvaro Frota

The al-Falujah massacre movie was emerged about thre months ago.

Indeed, we in Iraq-War.ru republish this issue in Video of U.S. bombing a large group civilians in Fallujah.

The post receved untill now 1500 readers and 50 commentors.

Aquele abraço!

Alvaro Frota

 
#9/28/2004 11:24:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

alvaro: the links don't work... but i understand that you found 'the origins' of the immages? can you try to post them again? or with some more info added?
cecile

 
#9/28/2004 12:30:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

My Dearest, most luscious Connie,

My little analogy on the world trade centre is related to the manner in which your ravishing, august self (and other unsavoury footpads) manage to rationalize what we saw in the Fallujah video. That is : the dextrous manner in which you managed to transform little dots on a street into bona fide insurgents in order to celebrate the death of what might easily have been civilians. I am merely pointing out that in performing your same game of mental denial, I am able to enjoy the sight of burning civilians too.

Oh, and I'm South African.

In awestruck reverence, gratitude and so forth,
Your humble toady,
Bruno

(Kinda fun, that)

 
#9/28/2004 12:34:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Jeffrey --

I see our resident self - proclaimed genius has engaged in more oral defecation. Well, please, pause for an instant to wipe the excreta from your mouth and clarify this:

"Brunhilda, if you can't tell the difference between the running of a government and a military operation, you're not worth engaging."

I'm unsure as to what you mean here. Are you saying vapourising Fallujah is justified because YOU are the government in Iraq, and Saddam was merely running military operations, or vice versa? I think you really ought to explain yourself here. What evidence leads you to believe that the volitalization of Fallujah is justified? Do your best here, now.

As for the rest of your posts, well, they are simply the usual waste of bytes and bandwidth. I think the spam I get has more content. Intestines dropping to the ground, bla bla bla. (I would recommend you pray to your god Bush every morning that there are a few thousand miles between you and those you blithely taunt, otherwise you would be chasing your head across your grotty apartment before long).

The rest of your stuff is just crap, which isn't surprising, as that matter leaks down from your cranium at a jolly old rate. Despite my numerous attempts to point out your stupidity in making an argument based on paternity and family links as being reflective of your own personal status / beliefs you persist in doing so. (And over the internet of all things ...)

Let me for (what I hope is) the last time try to massage your tired synapses into the right direction.

Now, true or false:

(1) You are American, so you are necessarily into child pornography
(2) Ron Reagan jr, the son of a rightwing GOP president, shares the same views as his father.
(3) Hendrick Verwoed's son is a fanatical supporter of Apartheid.
(4) If you are black, you love Nelson Mandela
(5) If you are a white in South Africa, you supported Apartheid.
(6) If you are a white in America, you killed Native Americans.
(7) You are American, so you necessarily love multiracial families.
(8) If one's relatives are multiracial, it means that person is always happy about it.
(9) If one's relatives are not multiracial, it means that person is always happy about it.
(10) If a guy makes a statement on the internet, he always tells the truth.

I am, of course, assuming that there are enough functional connections in the suppurated sludge you call a brain to catch the drift of what I am saying here.

For example: "... so we must REALLY BE EVIL, right?!" ... is a statement that cannot be answered by simply extrapolating from the claims that you yourself have made about your family. There is not really enough data to condemn the American people as a whole. You, on the other hand, I can confidently proclaim to be an imbecile.

(Ah well, let me know if you need more backhanders from my manly self in future. No need to thank me, the service is a pleasure.)

Your bestest bud,
Bruno

 
#9/28/2004 02:21:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Alvaro Frota

To Cecile:

The link to the news

AF

 
#9/28/2004 06:44:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Bruno!
You are South African? That's awesome! I mean....kind of....right? I've never known a South African. Glad to meet ya!

Connie

 
#9/28/2004 10:07:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger aNarki-13

Dudes Chill out... No matter the outcome of this discussion, it will not change the situation in iraq.
People and Soldiers are getting killed, innocent lives (if there is such a thing) are taken..
and it keeps getting worse.
Salam to all.

 
#9/29/2004 02:00:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

"the pilot himself reported 'numerous individuals'. He DID NOT say : "Abdul at the corner cafe' has said Zarqawi is moving into position." Ergo, he did not receive any 'tell' "

You do not know this. As we only see a few seconds after target acquisition. We do not hear, when maybe they have been following these people for an hour and maybe this was the first chance to hit them in the open.
The fact is we do not know the whole story. no one would unless you could find the attribution for this video
That is why I said what I said, to counter what "they" are saying by posting this.
How easy it is, to make video lie.

madtom

 
#9/29/2004 02:54:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger emigre

AnaRki13, i so completely agree.

can't believe people are still scrolling all the way back to this thread, me included.

 
#9/29/2004 03:41:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Madtom et al --

Ok, I've scrounged around, and from what I can tell, the video is a genuine military video. It's apologists have stated that the people bombed were heading towards an ongoing battle with Marines, and that that justified the pilot's decision. Here are some links:

http://www.gertzfile.com/gertzfile/ring082004.html
http://www.ufppc.org/index.php?option=content&task=view&id=1222&Itemid=2

http://www.clubcobra.com/t56875.html

I suggest googling "oh dude"+falluja+bomb for further sources. Still, it seems very strange that given the proximity of this so called battle, with US warplanes in the sky, that a big group of insurgents would saunter down the middle of a street all bunched up.

Basically we have only the military's word to go on that they were heading towards a battle, and we know how good *that* is.

 
#9/29/2004 06:11:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

"the people bombed were heading towards an ongoing battle with Marines"

Do you suggest that the Marines should allow the enemy to re-enforce their positions?

Madtom

 
#9/29/2004 06:42:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

*sigh*

What I am saying is ... that Marine story is what others have said. It may or may not be true. There were no reports of Marine assults on Fallujah during that time span. I have given my opinion on the video as to why I doubt the claim of the apologists that these were militants. The facts of the video tend to substantiate my claims more than they do theirs. That does not mean I am correct, of course. Basically, we don't have enough facts, full stop.

The US military has lied about the circumstances of civilian casulaties before, and they will do so again. THAT is the light the video ought to be seen in.

 
#9/29/2004 09:51:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

But the Marines story was not part of this post, just a few seconds of "some" video, maybe you should send all your research to the original posters so thay can update their story, maybe, with enough information to make what they say believable. I somehow doubt that they would want to see anything you send them as their probable intent was never to inform, Only to manipulate.
Go ahead I dare you, send them everything you got, see if they care.
The one I worry about is Khalid, is he with them or is he this gullible.

Madtom

 
#9/30/2004 01:52:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

"The one I worry about is Khalid, is he with them or is he this gullible."

Heh heh ... guillible cuts two ways, if you believe everything that the US military is supposed to have said. As I have stated, to me it looks like it could go either way. Although, a retired US serviceman, (who would be a better authority than I to make such remarks) Stan Goff commented on the video thusly:

"Stan Goff comments: "The “tell” is in the audio. When the pilot asks permission to fire, he reports a large number of people… not armed people. People. And permission is granted instantly. This is an indication that the mission guidance is to shoot anyone who is in the street. This is a clear war crime, and one that begins with the commander’s stated intent in the operations order. The pilot’s exclamation of satisfaction, “Aw dude!” at the end just underlines how this casual sadism comes to dominate the psyches of those who are part of a military occupation force, and how the ground reality become “race war.”"

(Stan Goff retired as a Master Sergeant from the US Army in 1996, his last assignment being 3rd Special Forces Group.)

For the last time, I am not saying for sure that they were civilians or insurgents. My criticism is that the decision to rub these people out was made in a state of ignorance ... and that in itself is a condemnation of the US armed forces. Similar indidents have already happened many times: Mazen Dana, the Palestine hotel, Gaith in Haifa street etc. etc.

The US military's policy is "shoot first, and cover up later".

 
#9/30/2004 08:44:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger madtom

Your quote from a retired guy is just as meaningless because he is only responding to what he sees in that video. I am the last person in the world that would believe everything anyone said about anything. All my friends call me doubting tom, because I question everything, drives them all mad.

"The US military's policy is "shoot first, and cover up later"."
LoL, This is America, do you think that we should invite them to tea first, then start shooting.

Madtom

 
#10/01/2004 09:03:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Errr ... thanks, your post says it all. Over and out.

 
#10/01/2004 03:32:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

The world needs to know how things are in Iraq.

Deliberate car bombing of children, free iraqis...murder of intellectuals, the intelligentsia.

...the first Fallujah pull-out was do to wide spread political concern.... innocent lives lost, americans in the city of mosques.... The high toll of seemingly innocent lives thrown in the fire by the "martyrs" themselves. The city recieved American goodwill and was givin an opportunity to right itself with the Fallujah Brigade.

The insurgents concealing themselves behind assorted masks while hiding among women and children won sympathy..nothing more.

..the soon to come 2nd entry into Fallujah, like Samarrah will be a joint effort led by Free Iraqis. There will be no sympathy for child killers this time.

...Khalids clip of film needs further study. I would like to know the time frame and surrounding events going on. Khalids spin suggests this was wanton killing. A bunch of what looks like young men hurrying off to a wedding or something...maybe they were going to the local swimming pool.

Could they have been determindly heading off cam to an ongoing battle? Yes, this is the most likely scene...but, we can't tell because Khalid presents this film to serve his aims without any surrounding detail. No facts.....only spin. Clearly, the US is not in the habit of indescriminate destruction. This we have seen proven time and again around mosques. If this were truely an episode of gross negligent killing, that could be supported by facts, Khalid would be the first to give you the sermon.

Khalid.....when I see march after march in the streets of Ma, Pa and baby Iraqi. When I see the streets boiling with the decent people of Iraq in protest. This is all that has to be done, by the way...peaceful protest...nothing more. Let the people themselves say they don't want democracy, moderation...modernization. When they say this then, and only then would I and so many others get on the peacenik bandwagon. I don't want to see marches in the streets of Paris Milan...Rome...London....NYC....San Francisco claiming to be for the good of people in Iraq.


salaam
partisan Hack101 :P

 
#10/01/2004 05:05:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger emigre

Dear partisan h4ck101

Please lay off Khalid. He is relatively trusting and innocent for someone living constantly under fire and you are really a far too experienced combatant to be having a go at someone much younger then yourself.

The clip is actually quite an old one in web terms, having been discussed extensively both online and off. Statements from legitimate military personal tend to imply the recorded images are authentic. Airstrikes did take place above a residential neighbourhood in Fallujah last month.

Besides, Khalid has to live with the very real consequences of war in his own city and as far as i am aware you do not. Give the boy a break.

 
#10/01/2004 06:08:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Phssst, grrrrrr...... Do I sound old??? Arrgghhhhhh...... :P

..no question from me about the authenticity, just the context portrayed.

Look, the "Awww dude" thing suxx. In no uncertain terms... Talk about the ugly American. Really it's profoundly shameful to me as well. I would far preferred he say something a little more humane. Something with a clear indication of concience....deep regret of the need of his action. Something to indicate that life itself is important to him...at least.

Hmmmmm...............hmmmmm. What if he would'ave said "Allah Akbar".. Don't throw stones folks...just talk to me.

Khalid, let me diplomatically extend a hand to you.

PartisanHack101 :P

 
#10/02/2004 12:44:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

yeh, he shoulda said something that arnie woulda said

like ' asta la vista, shitheads'

that wouldv'e been way cooler

 
#10/02/2004 01:36:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Hmmmmm.....Yeah, I realize there are some damn hard feelings about the state of affairs. Got some myself....but that was not quite what I was looking for Anon. A little more progressive in your thoughts, please. Now, go back to your seat and try again... I know you can do it.



Partisan Hack101 ^^

 
#10/04/2004 02:57:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

Partisan Hack 101 --

"... The city recieved American goodwill and was givin an opportunity to right itself with the Fallujah Brigade."

Alright. What do you mean by 'goodwill'? Do you mean that Americans stopped bombing civilian areas? And what do you mean by the "opportunity to right itself"? Do you mean "fall in with American plans"? Are American plans thus equated automatically in your mind with "right"?

"There will be no sympathy for child killers this time."

Oh good! I was wondering when these prowar types were going to start calling for the heads of those 'Coalition' soldiers killing children.

These children:
Independent Digital - Civilians bear brunt as Samarra 'pacified' By Kim Sengupta in Baghdad 4 Oct 2004

" The Americans insisted that the estimated 125 people killed in the storming of the city were all insurgents. Doctors and local people reported women, children and the elderly among the dead ... Local people in Samarra claimed that many of the 1,000 insurgents the Americans were targeting had escaped before the attack, and civilians had borne the brunt of the casualties. Of 70 bodies brought into Samarra General Hospital, 23 were children and 18 women, said Abdul-Nasser Hamed Yassin, a hospital administrator. There were also 23 women among the 160 wounded. "

And these:
Seven Iraqi children were killed in Falluja - Arabic News.com - 9/30/2004

Seven Iraqis were killed at the hands of the American forces near Falluja city situated to the west of the capital Baghdad on Wednesday evening. Medical sources explained that the killed were five children and two women from one family killed after the American forces opened fire at the car carrying them near an inspection point on the highway between Falluja and al-Ramadi. Dr. al-Hakim al-Badrani from the public hospital in Falluja said the hospital received three of the killed persons and six injured.

Let's not forget these:
U.S. Aircraft Reportedly Kills 40 Iraqis By SCHEHEREZADE FARAMARZI,
A P Writer - 20 may 2004

Associated Press Television News footage showed a truck containing bloodied bodies, many wrapped in blankets, piled one atop the other. Several were children, one of whom was decapitated. The body of a girl who appeared to be less than 5 years of age lay in a white sheet, her legs riddled with wounds and her dress soaked in blood.

And, this war crime:
Continued U.S. Airstrikes in Baghdad Draw Criticism
September 29, 2004 - By Ashraf Khalil, Times Staff Writer

In recent weeks, U.S. forces have also launched regular airstrikes on the town of Fallouja, west of Baghdad, which is controlled by Sunni Muslim insurgents. Although U.S. military operations supposedly are coordinated with Iraqi leaders, the Americans' increasing reliance on air attacks drew criticism Tuesday from the U.S.-backed interim Iraqi president ... President Ghazi Ajil Yawer ... Footage of injured and dead women and children being pulled from bombed buildings "brings to mind Gaza," Yawer said in an interview on CNN.

That *IS* what you are saying ... ?

 
#10/04/2004 02:59:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

"Hmmmmm...............hmmmmm. What if he would'ave said "Allah Akbar".. Don't throw stones folks...just talk to me."

OK. No stones.

My reply: If he had been an Iraqi pilot dumping a 500lb bomb on American insurgents / civilians / little dots in Chicago, like I saw in the video, I would have jumped up and down the same as I'm jumping up and down now.

Is that fair enough for you?

I'm willing to put my head on a (metaphorical) block and state that most Iraqis, prior to this war, would have agreed with me. Now? I'm not so sure.

Is that what you want?

 
#10/04/2004 11:50:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Ent Garde, El Bluto...

Does thou wish TO Joust..

....haha.. Very quickly, a couple of thoughts.

..........it was my mistake to continue this thread. Emigre and others were correct in basically saying you guys pissing on each other's heads were rapidly going nowhere.

My apologies to all for the child killing sentence and other provocations, imagined and otherwise. They were non productive. My only defence...emotion of the event.

True that I prefer the more mature and reasonable stance of Ali, Zeyad, Omar and so many others.... However, I do not consider this a pro-war stance. Nor, because someone stands across the aisle from me, are they neccasarily pro-war.

It may well be that we desire the same thing... Let the people of Iraq choose for themselves. Give them the opportunity to go to the polls.

Being bold, I'm going to say that this blog was created to develope understanding, foster productive dialogue, increase awarness and growth as human beings. Good attempt at that Emigre....compliments....hehe, don't want my ear pinched and sent off to the corner again...:P

Partisan Hack 101 ** outta this thread...

...oh, while I have your attention...someone tell Faiza to continue her learning Arabic blog, please. I was real sorry she quit that.

 
#10/04/2004 11:51:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Ent Garde, El Bluto...

Does thou wish TO Joust..

....haha.. Very quickly, a couple of thoughts.

..........it was my mistake to continue this thread. Emigre and others were correct in basically saying you guys pissing on each other's heads were rapidly going nowhere.

My apologies to all for the child killing sentence and other provocations, imagined and otherwise. They were non productive. My only defence...emotion of the event.

True that I prefer the more mature and reasonable stance of Ali, Zeyad, Omar and so many others.... However, I do not consider this a pro-war stance. Nor, because someone stands across the aisle from me, are they neccasarily pro-war.

It may well be that we desire the same thing... Let the people of Iraq choose for themselves. Give them the opportunity to go to the polls.

Being bold, I'm going to say that this blog was created to develope understanding, foster productive dialogue, increase awarness and growth as human beings. Good attempt at that Emigre....compliments....hehe, don't want my ear pinched and sent off to the corner again...:P

Partisan Hack 101 ** outta this thread...

...oh, while I have your attention...someone tell Faiza to continue her learning Arabic blog, please. I was real sorry she quit.

 
#10/04/2004 11:51:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Ent Garde, El Bluto...

Does thou wish TO Joust..

....haha.. Very quickly, a couple of thoughts.

..........it was my mistake to continue this thread. Emigre and others were correct in basically saying you guys pissing on each other's heads were rapidly going nowhere.

My apologies to all for the child killing sentence and other provocations, imagined and otherwise. They were non productive. My only defence...emotion of the event.

True that I prefer the more mature and reasonable stance of Ali, Zeyad, Omar and so many others.... However, I do not consider this a pro-war stance. Nor, because someone stands across the aisle from me, are they neccasarily pro-war.

It may well be that we desire the same thing... Let the people of Iraq choose for themselves. Give them the opportunity to go to the polls.

Being bold, I'm going to say that this blog was created to develope understanding, foster productive dialogue, increase awarness and growth as human beings. Good attempt at that Emigre....compliments....hehe, don't want my ear pinched and sent off to the corner again...:P

Partisan Hack 101 ** outta this thread...

...oh, while I have your attention...someone tell Faiza to continue her learning Arabic blog, please. I was real sorry she quit.

 
#10/04/2004 11:51:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Ent Garde, El Bluto...

Does thou wish TO Joust..

....haha.. Very quickly, a couple of thoughts.

..........it was my mistake to continue this thread. Emigre and others were correct in basically saying you guys pissing on each other's heads were rapidly going nowhere.

My apologies to all for the child killing sentence and other provocations, imagined and otherwise. They were non productive. My only defence...emotion of the event.

True that I prefer the more mature and reasonable stance of Ali, Zeyad, Omar and so many others.... However, I do not consider this a pro-war stance. Nor, because someone stands across the aisle from me, are they neccasarily pro-war.

It may well be that we desire the same thing... Let the people of Iraq choose for themselves. Give them the opportunity to go to the polls.

Being bold, I'm going to say that this blog was created to develope understanding, foster productive dialogue, increase awarness and growth as human beings. Good attempt at that Emigre....compliments....hehe, don't want my ear pinched and sent off to the corner again...:P

Partisan Hack 101 ** outta this thread...

...oh, while I have your attention...someone tell Faiza to continue her learning Arabic blog, please. I was real sorry she quit.

 
#10/04/2004 11:53:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Ent Garde, El Bluto...

Does thou wish TO Joust..

....haha.. Very quickly, a couple of thoughts.

..........it was my mistake to continue this thread. Emigre and others were correct in basically saying you guys pissing on each other's heads were rapidly going nowhere.

My apologies to all for the child killing sentence and other provocations, imagined and otherwise. They were non productive. My only defence...emotion of the event.

True that I prefer the more mature and reasonable stance of Ali, Zeyad, Omar and so many others.... However, I do not consider this a pro-war stance. Nor, because someone stands across the aisle from me, are they neccasarily pro-war.

It may well be that we desire the same thing... Let the people of Iraq choose for themselves. Give them the opportunity to go to the polls.

Being bold, I'm going to say that this blog was created to develope understanding, foster productive dialogue, increase awarness and growth as human beings. Good attempt at that Emigre....compliments....hehe, don't want my ear pinched and sent off to the corner again...:P

Partisan Hack 101 ** outta this thread...

...oh, while I have your attention...someone tell Faiza to continue her learning Arabic blog, please. I was real sorry she quit.

 
#10/05/2004 12:01:00 am Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

Oops.....loooooool... sorry...

ph101 -

 
#10/05/2004 09:22:00 am Assalam Aleikom Blogger Bruno

ph101 --

No problem about the multiple posts; with you here we can make 100 posts even w/ out Jeffrey's help ... heh heh ;)

I'll keep an eye out for you. Your later posts are more balanced and indicate the presence of a faculty of reason. That, of course, is good.

 
#10/07/2004 04:19:00 pm Assalam Aleikom Anonymous Anonymous

The Independent has an article: 6 October 2004 regarding the matter:

***
Take them out, dude: pilots toast hit on Iraqi 'civilians'
By Andrew Buncombe in Washington
06 October 2004

The Pentagon said yesterday it was investigating cockpit video footage that shows American pilots attacking and killing a group of apparently unarmed Iraqi civilians.
***

http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=569207
Cecile

 

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